Interview with Abu Mazen

In the Israeli daily, Yedioth Ahronoth, Nahum Barnea and Ronny Shaked report from their meeting in Ramallah with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas.

"Toward the end of our interview with him - the first interview since he joined Hamas in a national unity government - Mahmoud Abbas decided to talk about the future. It did not sound good. 'I have one year and nine months left in office,' he said. 'I am counting every day. I will complete my term of office and that will be it. I will not run for another term.'

What will you do then, we asked him? 'Come pick me up and we can go visit Safed, the city of my birth,' he answered. When Abu Mazin sought permission in 1994 to visit Safed, there was an almighty uproar among the Israeli Right, which said that the planned visit was a clever attempt to exercise the right of return. Abu Mazin made it as far as the home of MK Ahmed Tibi in Taibeh and, after consultations, decided instead to visit Haifa, where he was greeted by Mayor Amram Mitzna. 'The people who stopped me from visiting Safed do not know what peace is' says Abu Mazin.

One year and nine months is a long time in the life of a politician. But it is like the blinking of an eye in the Middle East. Abu Mazin, 72, will not admit as much, but he knows that if he finished his legal term of office, it will be as president of a non-country that carried the name of a people without a nation. As things currently look, it is unlikely that his term of office will be remembered as anything but a footnote in the tragic history of his people. His term is the period between the Arafat era and the abyss, between Arafat and Hamas.

Who will come after you, we asked: 'Whoever the people choose,' was the immediate answer.

Marwan Barghouti?

'Maybe,' Abu Mazin replied, without any trace of enthusiasm.

Haniyeh and Hamas? 'Maybe.'

To a large extent, the efforts that Abu Mazin put into giving legitimacy to the new Palestinian government have been superfluous. The international boycott has already been broken. It was broken despite the objections of the Israeli government. The U.S. cannot stand in the way. The U.S. Consul General in Jerusalem met last week with the new Palestinian finance minister in Ramallah. It is no coincidence that Salam Fayyad was appointed finance minister: he is a great favorite of the U.S. administration. On Saturday, when Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice arrives at the Muqata'a in Ramallah, she will not only meet Abu Mazin; she will also see Fayyad. Haniyeh, for the time being at least, has not been invited.

In this battle, Israel will almost certainly be defeated. Hamas has won. It has got its foot into the door of legitimacy. In addressing the Israeli people, Abu Mazin is simply trying to make the Israeli rearguard action shorter.

You appointed Mohammad Dahlan as your national security adviser. You made him part of the Hamas government.

'Dahlan is not in the government,' he insists. 'There is a distinction. The government is the government. It has its own agenda and the president has an agenda of his own. I have already stated that they will be responsible for domestic problems; I will take care of external problems.'

What are your thoughts on negotiations between Israel and Syria?

'From my point of view, you have to talk to Syria. Why should you not talk to them? Barak talked to them.'

There is, we said, a long-standing Israeli understanding that the Israeli government has the right to talk to only one Arab party at any one time. If we talk to Syria, we cannot talk with you.

'Nonsense,' he said. 'We are offering you a peace deal with 57 Moslem countries. You will no longer be a pariah state. The Israeli flag will fly from Indonesia and Mauritania to Morocco. Everyone is ready to back the Saudi initiative - which is the most serious peace plan since 1948.'"